( He's aware of it, a little. Not just how spaced Nate had been exactly, but the distant look. The slight detachment often accompanied by emotional fatigue. It's warranted, completely understandable considering the circumstances, so he doesn't mention it. He does lean a little more into Nate's shoulder, and slip a hand under the table to settle on his thigh. Nothing suggestive about it, it's just a gesture. An offering. )
Yup.
( Quietly amused as hell. )
Asked me what my intentions were with you and everything.
[ The anchor hooks into the meat of him and drags him back gently, slowly, with little pressure. Nate pinches the bridge of his nose, eyes shut tightly until he can see stars in the blackness and they dissipate again while he huffs. A muted laugh that catches before it can become anything that revels in too much humor for the circumstance. ]
Yeah, that...sounds like Sam.
[ Sam never got hinky or up in arms about it when it was a girl, from what Nate can remember of their youth. He'd ask probing questions, dip into territory that was (frankly) at times a little invasive, but Nate knew he was just happy to see Nathan "gettin' some."
Clearly it wasn't the same case here, but then, Sam never did get exceptionally involved if Nate was fooling around with a guy. Whether it was general discomfort or not knowing what to say outside of mildly encouraging platitudes, they were never in a position where Sam wanted to discuss it beyond ensuring his baby brother was being safe. ]
He was always pretty protective. [ Nate thumbs at his bottle, looking at Ian's hand. ] ...Did I tell you why we were in the orphanage?
( He's patient, unhurried. Willing to wait quietly while Nate presses his fingers into his eyes and processes his thoughts. When he finally speaks, a small smile plays about Ian's lips. As ridiculously silly as it seemed at the time, he can think back to the Aerie and see the consistent theme. Sam's underlying motivation seems to generally always be based around Nate's wellbeing, even if it manifested in counterintuitive ways.
He's not expecting the conversational turn, and that subtle surprise can be found in his eyebrows if you look close enough. )
No, I don't think we've talked about it.
( Not much, aside from that exchange sixty stories up. Ian drew his own conclusions, but he's flagged it in his mind as an area he shouldn't dig. It's the kind of subject Nate has to bring up and talk about on his own. )
[ Nate normally wouldn't touch this subject with a forty-foot pole, knows it would be a simple matter to just hold hands and pass some sad sentiments over through the empathy hotline and call it a day, but he needs Ian to understand the extent of that protection. The lengths Sam Drake would go to, to ensure his little brother was all right. The man had his fucking selfish moments but the decisions he made always rested under the same umbrella. ]
I lost my mom really young. She, um. She was smart, a historian. Taught us Latin. [ Nate was so small he barely remembers more than a few faint recollections burnished by Sam's stronger memories. ] She killed herself when I was four.
[ There was a funeral, small and sedate. His older brother's hand gripping his tightly, avoiding the questions he asked because Nate didn't understand. He scratches at the label on his beer, brow furrowed slightly at nothing in particular. ]
Our dad kind of held onto us for a year, and then he just sort of...dropped us off. [ Pat, matter of fact. ] We stayed with the nuns after that. I was pretty young and I'd get scared so I'd- sometimes, early on, I actually snuck into the older boys' dormitory to beg Sam to let me sleep in his bed.
[ Nate rolls his head back, leaning it on the seat cushion of the couch and staring up at the set concrete of the ceiling, concentrating on the warmth at his side, on his thigh, knowing this is A Lot bordering on Too Much. ]
We snuck out often. Broke into a house together when I was twelve, it was this...old lady who'd worked with our mom and we wanted her stuff back, and she had a heart attack- right there. Right after telling us she'd call the cops off.
I couldn't go back after they spotted us, and Sam had gotten kicked out for stealing and smoking the same year. So we left. [ His head lolls to one side, looking at Ian. ] It was just us.
( Jesus. The hand at Nate's thigh tightens a little, fingers flexing out of the mindless instinct to hang on. Like it'll do anything, like it can retroactively comfort him. It eases up again gradually, turns into a thumb passing back and forth in quiet, concerned support.
The disbelief and unfairness running through him isn't his to feel, and the sense of abandonment burning underneath it isn't entirely based in empathy alone. It calls forth an echo of an old feeling of his own, one he's never truly worked through enough to let go of. Just makes the pang in his chest a little harder for it.
He looks back, a knit in his brow but otherwise he's... doing his best to keep control over his expression. People usually hate pity, and while sympathy isn't the same thing the look that accompanies it can often be similar. He doesn't want to punish Nate for the limb he's going out on, wind up accidentally making him immediately regret it.
He could say I'm sorry, he could say you deserve better than that, he could say I know it's not the same, but my mom chose to go too, so I get it a little bit. None of that feels right, and he knows the story was meant to be context for the actual subject of the night: Sam.
What he ultimately settles on is careful, gentle. )
He really cares about you down to the bone. Even before knowing why, it was impossible to miss that.
[ Nate can feel Ian trying to school his expressions, trying to figure out what he's supposed to say and how. They both understand what it is to be abandoned, to feel left behind, to feel unwanted, and to this day it's a difficult emotion to kick when something hits that soft spot again, and again. It dulls with time. Like a scar tissue sacrificing nerve endings, a space that becomes numb through repeated exposure.
Another thing to carry around.
He watches the soft knit of Ian's brow and the slight downturn of his mouth, the hesitation catching his throat looking for words to avoid cutting Nate any deeper. Unnecessary effort, but appreciated. It was a long time ago. ]
He does. Even when he was being a selfish bastard, I- I know that. It's just-
[ Nate gestures with both hands before they fall back into his lap. ]
It's complicated. I love him, he tried to protect me, I still died. But the only reason I was out there on that cliff in the first place is because he lied to me. He appeared out of nowhere after I thought I'd lost him, resurrected an old job, gave me some bullshit story about how he was in trouble and he needed me- [ Jaw tense and actively working himself up, Nate immediately shuts the faucet off. ] ...I'm sorry. I'm not saying it's his fault, that's not fair, but when he showed up here I begged him to never lie to me again. He couldn't make that promise.
( The furrow in his brow deepens, a mild incredulity slipping in among the concern.
His tongue passes across his lips, and he drags his eyes down to the coffee table for a second while he tries to think -- tries to decide what he should and shouldn't say.
Honestly, the full context might help. May as well just ramble about it a little, because just fully saying things - when possible, when not something particularly personal or painful - has been his go-to. )
I think I have this really... unrealistic view of what relationships are supposed to be like. I mean... not necessarily romantic, but friends, siblings, you know, all of them. I was, um, practically raised by books and TV, and before Kyna the closest friend I had was gone like my first year of college, so. It took me a little while for her to chill me out on it, and I'm still not sure if what I think half the time is realistic or if I got it from Stand By Me. My point is, as a blanket statement, probably take my opinions here with a dozen grains of salt, but...
( A slow, rhythmic shake of his head. )
I can understand lying to you. People make mistakes. People fuck up all the time. What matters is that they try not to fuck up again later, so... not being able to promise you that is kind of...
( He looks back up, lips pursing, shrugging one shoulder apologetically. )
I don't think that's something I could... handle. Easily. Personally. I don't know how you managed to just keep on... keeping on, with that hanging over you guys. I'm sorry if that's judgmental.
[ It marches neatly in line with what Ian has told Nate about himself before, it gives more definition to the hesitation he has with regards to intimacy and fills in the blank spaces. Nate wouldn't call himself an expert by any stretch of the imagination, but he knows he's further along and remembers what it took for him to get there. ]
It's not. And you're not wrong for thinking it's shitty, either. I, um. Had a pretty rough time even talking to him, after he got here.
[ As though the wound Nate had finally started stitching up was rent open all over again, spilling him everywhere, until he snapped on a dark night in the dimly-lit bar of Red Wings. Everything fell out while Stephen helplessly listened and knew there was nothing he could offer in return to staunch the flow. Just mild platitudes and a sympathetic squeeze to his shoulder, imploring him to crack now so he wouldn't implode later.
It wasn't half-bad advice. ]
...It's hard to explain how you can love someone and not want to forgive them. Or can't. Or how you forgive them, but may not necessarily trust them. It opens you up to a lot of hurt. And I'm not excusing it, I know that kinda "letting it slide" mentality can breed resentment, but...he spent thirteen years in prison while I was seeing the world. And I- I got to grow, you know? I got to meet people, and know them, and become...someone without him. And he was...stuck.
[ Nate has thought about this for a while, the development Sam was deprived of in a cell, all the lost time, all the years he needed to catch up on. A guy gets out of prison and looks up the kid brother who used to depend on him for everything, and he's doing just fine.
He shifts to set his beer on the table, looping the arm between them up onto the sofa cushions with his fingertips braced on Ian's nape. Nate's tone slows, a little more thoughtful, trying to work out the sentiments left twisted up for too long. ]
I wasn't holding out for him to change so much as I- I had so many opportunities that I fucked up. People I hurt, or left. Relationships I just trashed because they scared the crap out of me. But I had people giving me second, and third, and fourth chances. And I wouldn't be who I am without them. Maybe he would have eventually made that promise, maybe not. But I wasn't gonna not him the chance.
( His mouth twists gently into a sad, understanding smile. )
I definitely know what it's like to love someone and not forgive them. Not quite the same situation, obviously, but that part I know.
( But the expectations, the right and wrong of it, that he's less confident about.
He settles back into the touch just a little, a barely visible recline and pressure on Nate's fingertips. His hand goes from a stationary base and sweeping thumb to a gentle back and forth rub, calloused palm sliding along denim just a few inches and back again. )
And I know prison complicates it all. I mean, your entire... dynamic was complicated, I just...
( Still can't wrap his head around it -- not even necessarily Nate's tolerance of it, but he can't put himself in Sam's mentality. He can't imagine fucking up that bad and expecting a relationship without even pretending to treat something as important as trust and honesty with the appropriate reverence.
But hey, what the fuck does he know? He's not exactly the model of healthy interpersonal relationships.
Plus, it's not his opinion that matters, and not the point. )
I hear a lot of you taking up for him, which is... great, it really is, I love that you're so loyal to him. I just wanna make sure, like... you know you're allowed to feel upset, right? You can know all of this stuff logically and still be allowed to feel hurt. You can definitely be upset that you got this extra time together and he left with you still feeling hurt.
It would be a valid critique of his character, that he has in the past been walked over for it, that it ties into his gullibility. He never thought twice about Googling Hector Alcazar because he knew the name, he knew Sam, and given the trajectory of their lives it sounded plausible.
Ian says his piece and it's valid and Nate knows it, glancing down at the hand on his thigh. Just because Ian has less experience doesn't mean his thoughts have no merit, and maybe Nate would think of this differently without the foundation of all the time he was screwed over in the past, the times he screwed people over in return. ]
I know. I know, I'm not trying to pretend I'm not still angry and...and hurt. I am. [ God, is he ever. He took a ridiculously long walk with Ellie just to get out of his head about it. Softer: ] I just can't hold onto that forever. It'll only hurt more.
( There's another twitch of a smile - or maybe it's just his lips pulling into his cheeks. A beat of silence because he'd be a hypocrite here if he said anything. He's been carrying his anger and hurt for so long, and the likelihood of him actually dealing with it long enough to get past it is slim to none.
He can only gently nod, because the concept seems healthy and right.
He does kind of what to know -- )
So... not holding onto it involves getting into really intense fights?
( Sorry for probing, man, he's just concerned. He can't help but circle back to it. )
Do I need to worry about you winding up with a broken neck or a sudden vendetta against a bald guy named Butch?
[ Another fair point, but without the necessary context of Nate's proclivity toward getting into increasingly dangerous and absurdist situations, it's no wonder Ian thinks trading a few blows qualifies as an extreme hobby. ]
...I think we're going to have to make some adjustments to your impression of what constitutes an "intense" fight, but no, it's- it's more like stress relief that I will try to refrain from more often. Or-
[ He follows up, palm smoothing over the juncture between Ian's neck and shoulder. ]
You come scope it out, feel better about the situation.
( His eyebrows hike higher. They ask you realize that doesn't make it any better right before Nate preemptively answers the question himself, and he finds at least a little measure of humor in the fact that Nate knows him well enough to tack that on. )
Uh-huh...
( He drawls out with muted skepticism. )
Okay, fine. But I'll say it right now, if it looks like you're gonna get your ass kicked I'm not responsible for my actions.
![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
no subject
Yup.
( Quietly amused as hell. )
Asked me what my intentions were with you and everything.
no subject
Yeah, that...sounds like Sam.
[ Sam never got hinky or up in arms about it when it was a girl, from what Nate can remember of their youth. He'd ask probing questions, dip into territory that was (frankly) at times a little invasive, but Nate knew he was just happy to see Nathan "gettin' some."
Clearly it wasn't the same case here, but then, Sam never did get exceptionally involved if Nate was fooling around with a guy. Whether it was general discomfort or not knowing what to say outside of mildly encouraging platitudes, they were never in a position where Sam wanted to discuss it beyond ensuring his baby brother was being safe. ]
He was always pretty protective. [ Nate thumbs at his bottle, looking at Ian's hand. ] ...Did I tell you why we were in the orphanage?
no subject
He's not expecting the conversational turn, and that subtle surprise can be found in his eyebrows if you look close enough. )
No, I don't think we've talked about it.
( Not much, aside from that exchange sixty stories up. Ian drew his own conclusions, but he's flagged it in his mind as an area he shouldn't dig. It's the kind of subject Nate has to bring up and talk about on his own. )
tw: suicide mention
I lost my mom really young. She, um. She was smart, a historian. Taught us Latin. [ Nate was so small he barely remembers more than a few faint recollections burnished by Sam's stronger memories. ] She killed herself when I was four.
[ There was a funeral, small and sedate. His older brother's hand gripping his tightly, avoiding the questions he asked because Nate didn't understand. He scratches at the label on his beer, brow furrowed slightly at nothing in particular. ]
Our dad kind of held onto us for a year, and then he just sort of...dropped us off. [ Pat, matter of fact. ] We stayed with the nuns after that. I was pretty young and I'd get scared so I'd- sometimes, early on, I actually snuck into the older boys' dormitory to beg Sam to let me sleep in his bed.
[ Nate rolls his head back, leaning it on the seat cushion of the couch and staring up at the set concrete of the ceiling, concentrating on the warmth at his side, on his thigh, knowing this is A Lot bordering on Too Much. ]
We snuck out often. Broke into a house together when I was twelve, it was this...old lady who'd worked with our mom and we wanted her stuff back, and she had a heart attack- right there. Right after telling us she'd call the cops off.
I couldn't go back after they spotted us, and Sam had gotten kicked out for stealing and smoking the same year. So we left. [ His head lolls to one side, looking at Ian. ] It was just us.
no subject
The disbelief and unfairness running through him isn't his to feel, and the sense of abandonment burning underneath it isn't entirely based in empathy alone. It calls forth an echo of an old feeling of his own, one he's never truly worked through enough to let go of. Just makes the pang in his chest a little harder for it.
He looks back, a knit in his brow but otherwise he's... doing his best to keep control over his expression. People usually hate pity, and while sympathy isn't the same thing the look that accompanies it can often be similar. He doesn't want to punish Nate for the limb he's going out on, wind up accidentally making him immediately regret it.
He could say I'm sorry, he could say you deserve better than that, he could say I know it's not the same, but my mom chose to go too, so I get it a little bit. None of that feels right, and he knows the story was meant to be context for the actual subject of the night: Sam.
What he ultimately settles on is careful, gentle. )
He really cares about you down to the bone. Even before knowing why, it was impossible to miss that.
no subject
Another thing to carry around.
He watches the soft knit of Ian's brow and the slight downturn of his mouth, the hesitation catching his throat looking for words to avoid cutting Nate any deeper. Unnecessary effort, but appreciated. It was a long time ago. ]
He does. Even when he was being a selfish bastard, I- I know that. It's just-
[ Nate gestures with both hands before they fall back into his lap. ]
It's complicated. I love him, he tried to protect me, I still died. But the only reason I was out there on that cliff in the first place is because he lied to me. He appeared out of nowhere after I thought I'd lost him, resurrected an old job, gave me some bullshit story about how he was in trouble and he needed me- [ Jaw tense and actively working himself up, Nate immediately shuts the faucet off. ] ...I'm sorry. I'm not saying it's his fault, that's not fair, but when he showed up here I begged him to never lie to me again. He couldn't make that promise.
no subject
His tongue passes across his lips, and he drags his eyes down to the coffee table for a second while he tries to think -- tries to decide what he should and shouldn't say.
Honestly, the full context might help. May as well just ramble about it a little, because just fully saying things - when possible, when not something particularly personal or painful - has been his go-to. )
I think I have this really... unrealistic view of what relationships are supposed to be like. I mean... not necessarily romantic, but friends, siblings, you know, all of them. I was, um, practically raised by books and TV, and before Kyna the closest friend I had was gone like my first year of college, so. It took me a little while for her to chill me out on it, and I'm still not sure if what I think half the time is realistic or if I got it from Stand By Me. My point is, as a blanket statement, probably take my opinions here with a dozen grains of salt, but...
( A slow, rhythmic shake of his head. )
I can understand lying to you. People make mistakes. People fuck up all the time. What matters is that they try not to fuck up again later, so... not being able to promise you that is kind of...
( He looks back up, lips pursing, shrugging one shoulder apologetically. )
I don't think that's something I could... handle. Easily. Personally. I don't know how you managed to just keep on... keeping on, with that hanging over you guys. I'm sorry if that's judgmental.
no subject
It's not. And you're not wrong for thinking it's shitty, either. I, um. Had a pretty rough time even talking to him, after he got here.
[ As though the wound Nate had finally started stitching up was rent open all over again, spilling him everywhere, until he snapped on a dark night in the dimly-lit bar of Red Wings. Everything fell out while Stephen helplessly listened and knew there was nothing he could offer in return to staunch the flow. Just mild platitudes and a sympathetic squeeze to his shoulder, imploring him to crack now so he wouldn't implode later.
It wasn't half-bad advice. ]
...It's hard to explain how you can love someone and not want to forgive them. Or can't. Or how you forgive them, but may not necessarily trust them. It opens you up to a lot of hurt. And I'm not excusing it, I know that kinda "letting it slide" mentality can breed resentment, but...he spent thirteen years in prison while I was seeing the world. And I- I got to grow, you know? I got to meet people, and know them, and become...someone without him. And he was...stuck.
[ Nate has thought about this for a while, the development Sam was deprived of in a cell, all the lost time, all the years he needed to catch up on. A guy gets out of prison and looks up the kid brother who used to depend on him for everything, and he's doing just fine.
He shifts to set his beer on the table, looping the arm between them up onto the sofa cushions with his fingertips braced on Ian's nape. Nate's tone slows, a little more thoughtful, trying to work out the sentiments left twisted up for too long. ]
I wasn't holding out for him to change so much as I- I had so many opportunities that I fucked up. People I hurt, or left. Relationships I just trashed because they scared the crap out of me. But I had people giving me second, and third, and fourth chances. And I wouldn't be who I am without them. Maybe he would have eventually made that promise, maybe not. But I wasn't gonna not him the chance.
no subject
I definitely know what it's like to love someone and not forgive them. Not quite the same situation, obviously, but that part I know.
( But the expectations, the right and wrong of it, that he's less confident about.
He settles back into the touch just a little, a barely visible recline and pressure on Nate's fingertips. His hand goes from a stationary base and sweeping thumb to a gentle back and forth rub, calloused palm sliding along denim just a few inches and back again. )
And I know prison complicates it all. I mean, your entire... dynamic was complicated, I just...
( Still can't wrap his head around it -- not even necessarily Nate's tolerance of it, but he can't put himself in Sam's mentality. He can't imagine fucking up that bad and expecting a relationship without even pretending to treat something as important as trust and honesty with the appropriate reverence.
But hey, what the fuck does he know? He's not exactly the model of healthy interpersonal relationships.
Plus, it's not his opinion that matters, and not the point. )
I hear a lot of you taking up for him, which is... great, it really is, I love that you're so loyal to him. I just wanna make sure, like... you know you're allowed to feel upset, right? You can know all of this stuff logically and still be allowed to feel hurt. You can definitely be upset that you got this extra time together and he left with you still feeling hurt.
no subject
It would be a valid critique of his character, that he has in the past been walked over for it, that it ties into his gullibility. He never thought twice about Googling Hector Alcazar because he knew the name, he knew Sam, and given the trajectory of their lives it sounded plausible.
Ian says his piece and it's valid and Nate knows it, glancing down at the hand on his thigh. Just because Ian has less experience doesn't mean his thoughts have no merit, and maybe Nate would think of this differently without the foundation of all the time he was screwed over in the past, the times he screwed people over in return. ]
I know. I know, I'm not trying to pretend I'm not still angry and...and hurt. I am. [ God, is he ever. He took a ridiculously long walk with Ellie just to get out of his head about it. Softer: ] I just can't hold onto that forever. It'll only hurt more.
no subject
He can only gently nod, because the concept seems healthy and right.
He does kind of what to know -- )
So... not holding onto it involves getting into really intense fights?
( Sorry for probing, man, he's just concerned. He can't help but circle back to it. )
Do I need to worry about you winding up with a broken neck or a sudden vendetta against a bald guy named Butch?
no subject
...I think we're going to have to make some adjustments to your impression of what constitutes an "intense" fight, but no, it's- it's more like stress relief that I will try to refrain from more often. Or-
[ He follows up, palm smoothing over the juncture between Ian's neck and shoulder. ]
You come scope it out, feel better about the situation.
no subject
Little does he know.
A little concern muddles with amusement as it flits through the bond beneath Nate's hand. )
You think watching you get punched in the face first-hand is gonna make me feel better?
no subject
[ Nate insists, as though this is helpful information and not at all mildly concerning in any way, shape or form. ]
I know how it sounds. But I'm pretty good at it, and I wouldn't suggest it if I didn't think you wouldn't get something out of it.
no subject
Uh-huh...
( He drawls out with muted skepticism. )
Okay, fine. But I'll say it right now, if it looks like you're gonna get your ass kicked I'm not responsible for my actions.